Rules under Work - page 7
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There is pampering going on at the moment. Everything is still ahead of us.
Do you think so? OK, let's look at a situation like this. A customer has come up with some great idea that generates 1000% profit per month. You write software for it. Do you undertake to never use this idea? Even if you promise, will you keep your promise? This is nonsense. You can not only use the idea in your trade, but make another superficially different, but inside the same software and sell it as much as you like, without the source code nobody can prove anything. The rights of the customer can not be protected here. And if so, why should the rights of the programmer be better protected?
And pampering will never end. Because of the complete lack of protection of customer rights there will be no serious orders.
1. But the point is that in such a case, you have to somehow make it clear to the customer what results (in this case, files) they want to get.
This complicates the process and does not make sense at the application stage. Later everything can be discussed.
2. This is a serious question, too. You have to think about it. It is not only the performers who should be obliged, but also the customers should specify more complete information already at the application stage. Perhaps it makes sense to expand the application. Introduce some ideas. For example, to protect even a commissioned product. Personally, I always protected my developments (MT4) by checking on account. Well, the question is not about me...
1. I meant that in the application you have to "tick" or any other mentioning only about transfer of rights on performed work.
The transfer of rights as I understand it guarantees the customer all the source code, documentation and other materials (if any) + full and unlimited rights to sell and use the results of the contractor's work.
If the transfer is not granted, the contractor has a chance to offer his own terms and conditions, to which the client may agree or not.
In our case, all these conditions should be reflected in the ToR. The following information should also be included: the names, types and locations of the files (in case the specialized modules are present).
2. more or less serious protection can only be provided by developers, but this is then in the "MAGAZINE" service. Here it is mainly about how to enforce the rights of the customer and the executor.
The easiest way to somehow protect the rights of the contractor is not to transfer the source code to the customer, but at the same time leaving the right to purchase the exclusive rights to the software solution.
The customer must provide more detailed information I agree, sometimes from the description given in the request is clear only that the customer wants something for $10 (which he himself does not know yet) ...
It makes sense more seriously to approach TK (try to standardize it).
PS
At the expense of the selected sorry, but laugh. I'm not 100% sure, but 95% sure - software solutions made in pure MQL4 will not work (at least I've never seen one that if you want and enough time could not be broken).
Do you think so? OK, let's look at a situation like this. A customer has come up with some great idea that generates 1000% profit per month. You write software for it. Do you undertake to never use this idea? Even if you promise, will you keep your promise? This is nonsense. You can not only use the idea in your trade, but make another superficially different, but inside the same software and sell it as much as you like, without the source code nobody can prove anything. The rights of the customer can not be protected here. And if so, why should the rights of the programmer be better protected?
And the dabbling will never end. Because the customer's rights are completely unprotected, there will be no serious orders.
1. Good ideas don't yield 1000% a month. I hope I do not need to explain why. I would even try to forget about 1000% per year.
2. Suppose the client really thought out how to earn 100% annually, while being stable and not risking much. Suppose he spent on the creation of its TC from 6 to 12 months, while the estimated cost of his idea is say from 1000 to 10000 Bq. Let's assume that a fair price for TC will be $1000.
Now the customer has the following options:
а. Split his TS into modules and distribute them among several executors. Let's say the job is performed by 10 performers and they receive on the average $50. In the end, the client spends $500 not caring much about the TC in its original form to be used by someone or disseminated elsewhere.
Further questions will be how to put it all together and whether or not the client will get exclusive rights (including code) to the software solutions they are paying for.
б. The customer will give everything to one programmer, who will do all the work for the same $500. In this case, the convenience of the customer is that he asks only for one contractor, and the contractor has the advantage of seeing the entire TC.
There is also the question of transfer of rights, but the implementer can offer the customer to keep confidentiality (how it will look is another matter).
в. The author of TS can try to implement it himself, with certain risks and reservations, of course (but after all it is his business).
PS
Not every trader wants to become a programmer and not every programmer is ready to become a trader, and the amount of $500-1000 per month has not prevented anyone yet.
1. great ideas don't yield 1000% a month. I hope I don't need to explain why.
Honestly, you do. It would be interesting to know. But if you want to repeat well-known "truths" that are written everywhere and haven't helped anyone, don't bother. I'm afraid I'll never understand them.
Suppose a fair price for a TC would be $1000.
I can't accept such an estimate. A TC can't be worth $1000. It can either be priceless or free. If a free TC can be sold to someone for $1000, it does not cease to be inherently free. There are only freebies in orders. They're not completely useless, they help you think and understand why you can't do it that way. So there is nothing wrong with placing or executing such orders for a little money. Well if someone decides to junk and screw someone over, who cares? Just the level of performance should match the order, no need to put your valuable designs in all sorts of crap.
Splitting a TC into modules seems to be the only way to protect the interests of the customer, but is not always possible. A simple TS can't be divided into 10 parts. And the parts must be somehow put together, and it's not a fact that everything fits together.
That is why I had to master programming. TC is simple and I don't want to show it to anyone. But I wouldn't pay more than a can of beer for an executable that you don't know what and how it counts and when it will stop running.
Frankly speaking, I do. It would be interesting to learn. But if you want to repeat well-known "truths" that are written everywhere and haven't helped anyone, don't bother. I'm afraid I'll never understand them.
I will not give the well-known truth, I'm tired of explaining to people why the TS which brings say 100% on average per month, is better than the one that brings 1000% (assuming that the second works only for a month). Probably do not need to explain what good is a trading system that yields an average of 100% a year. Also I'm probably not going to explain the basics of creating effective and efficient trading systems.
I just ask you to calculate the risks and answer one simple question - for a deposit under the management of which of these three systems would you personally agree to give half of the capital that you possess?
I can't accept that assessment. A TC cannot be worth $1,000. It can either be priceless or free. If a free TC can be sold to someone for $1000, it is not inherently free. There are only freebies in orders. They're not completely useless, they help you think and understand why you can't do it that way. So there is nothing wrong with placing or executing such orders for a little money. Well if someone decides to junk and screw someone over, who cares? Just the level of performance should match the order, no need to put your valuable designs in all sorts of crap.
Splitting a TC into modules seems to be the only way to protect the interests of the customer, but is not always possible. A simple TS can't be divided into 10 parts. And the parts must be somehow put together, and it's not a fact that everything fits together.
That is why I had to master programming. TC is simple and I don't want to show it to anyone. But I would not pay more than a can of beer for an executable, which I don't know what it does and how it counts, and when it stops running.
1. GRAILS NO!!! Any trading system has its value expressed in terms of time spent on it, public acceptance or a certain amount of money.
Believe me, as a person who has 5-6 years engaged in the development of their own TS, as well as the analysis and study of other people's TS.
2. Why not? It may well, I would even say that $ 1000 is quite an objective price for trading strategies that most traders use.
Let me clarify, I don't mean the cost of trading expert or other software, designed to trade on this TS. The cost means the costs in specific units for creation and fine-tuning of the strategy. Such costs include: time spent on creating the strategy; Internet costs; amounts spent on testing and fine-tuning; other indirect costs.
3 There are no free trading systems, and there cannot be. It cannot be free only because someone spent time and probably other resources on its development. The TS may be effective or ineffective, generally available (common) or unique. That is all there is to it.
4. Concerning the "Jobs" service and orders there. It is true, in most cases, there are trading systems that are not worth $ 100, let alone $ 1000. But this can easily be explained by the fact that beginners and most traders who decide to do trading automation for the first time, use the most simple and widely available strategies (often without trying to add something new to them).
The standard logic of such customers is to find on the Internet (preferably for free) a description of a simple trading system, automate it, say for $10-50 and start cutting the profits.
The customer does not care that it works only once, if it works at all. They may not be so worried about the fact that the system has already been used to sink more than one deposit.
PS
I'm not saying that the orders for $ 1-10 TC have no right to exist (separate scripts, indicators, libraries, and so on, we will not take into account).
I meant the situation in which the customer does or does not get the absolute rights.
A simple example: The Developer transfers the completed work to the customer without exclusive rights (in this case, the source code is not transferred). This allows him without any problems to put the result of his work in the SHOP (and here the customer can not do anything).
Curious. I don't know about 1000%. but i once managed to create a system which is almost evenly withdraws balance from 100$ to several millions (during testing period till 2006). huge amount of trades, hundreds per day. It's sad, of course, that it works till 2006, even though I wrote this system in 2009 ))))). I think that maybe history will repeat itself...
Now try to find a DC for this trading system and provide ideal trading conditions.
Again (for those who are not in the know), any system bringing an average of 100% and above is EXTREMELY RISKY and lives usually 1-3 months.
For championships such strategies are good, for real life they are absolutely useless (in hands of beginners they are deadly).
Curious. I don't know about 1000%. but I once managed to create a system that almost evenly withdraws balance from 100$ to several millions (during testing period till 2006). huge amount of trades, hundreds per day. It's sad, of course, that it works till 2006, even though I wrote this system in 2009 ))))). I think maybe the history will repeat itself.
We know, we've come across it :)
I will not give the well-known truth, I'm tired of explaining to people why an average TS is bringing in, say, 100% per month, better than the one that brings 1000% (assuming that the second works only for a month). Probably do not need to explain what good is a trading system that yields an average of 100% a year. Also I'm probably not going to explain the basics of effective and efficient trading systems.
I will only ask you to calculate the risks and answer one simple question - On a deposit under the management of which of these three systems would you personally agree to give half of the capital you have?
If it's about trust management, then I will not trust anyone with a ruble, until I understand why a successful trader needs someone else's money.
I also can't understand how a trading system can work for a month and then stop working. Usually this is the result of tweaking to the story with a tester that I don't even know how to use. Although it can be checked even with a tester. Change the currency pair or timeframe. If the result changes strongly, the TS is discarded. It would not even be easy to sell it to someone. The usual explanation is that the "parameters are optimized for a particular pair and a particular timeframe". They just forget to add that they have also been optimized for a certain timeframe and that this timeframe is in the past. If there are people here who do something like this, I understand why they are so reluctant to give the source code.
There doesn't have to be a direct proportion between risk and profit unless we're talking about a single trade.
And if the basics of creating efficient and workable trading systems exist, work and are known to all, then why does almost everyone lose?
2. Why not? Yes it can, I would even say that $ 1000 is a reasonable price for trading strategies that most traders use.
It means we are just talking about different things. For example, the strategy is to buy when МА5 crosses МА21 from below and sell when it crosses it from above. This strategy is priced at 2 pennies. This I call "free TS". But if an automaton with a nice control panel and a lot of smart features is written using this strategy, it can be sold for 1000. But the strategy has not become good because of that. And all work must be paid for, if the customer got what he wanted, there is no arguing with that.
P.S. I also thought about what ... If the TC made by you for the customer brings a good income, you can not worry that the source code will go to hand. It will go only if it fails. Or it brings a stable, but ridiculous income.